Evolving Taste - A Quotable Conversation

Theres something sexy about talking Hip Hop with a dope chick whose knowlegeable about The Culture. D and I fall into these deep, occassionally theoretical, often anger enducing conversations on a fairly regular basis. This one took place over gmail chat the week 808s & Heartbreak (click here for review) and Theatre of the Mind (click here for review) dropped, and evolves from an album-quality-discussion into album-taste-discussion. Pretty interesting. Read on.

(...begins right after reading The Quotable's review of 808s & Heartbreak.)

TCM: so thats what i thought
Danielle: got it. i agreed with most of what you said.
i don't think his content is necessarily bad, i just don't think people will really listen
TCM: i didn't think the content was bad
i thought a quarter of the album was suspect
and the rest was pretty dope
its about the beats in my opinion
Danielle: i agree, but i have a feeling it wont do very well
TCM: not by his standards...i agree
it'll go plat though
i think it will expand his fan base
Danielle: b/c it has his name on it
TCM: while pissing off the core
Danielle: yup
we learned that in marketing
disruption of your core consumer base can be a problem when its a highly competitive market
TCM: but its not that competitive right now
Danielle: that's what i was going to say. lucky for him
overall i probably wouldn't listen to it more than a couple of times
i like some of the tracks and there are a few lines that i really really like
TCM: Amazing is amazing
or maybe - amazing is Amazing
Danielle: yup. amazing. love lockdown.
and heartless.
TCM: welcome to heartbreak
Danielle: it actually makes me a little sad
to be honest
TCM: me too...
thats what i like about it
Danielle: but you don't like sad stuff
TCM: i don't gravitate towards it
Danielle: no. do you really feel like you are missing something in your life not having love and family? that was a sad part of your quotable
TCM: i do. but at the sametime i don't think thats something i should rush into until I'm absolutely ready
Danielle: so you have no need to be sad about it
b/c in someways its voluntary and a product of your own personal timing
TCM: but i'm not sad about it
i didn't mean for it to translate that way
Danielle: are you going to do one for luda?
TCM: preliminary reviewing now
MVP is crazy!
i've listened to it 4 times now
in a row
Danielle: hmm. you know, i might actually take back what i said about kanye's album
TCM: what do you mean
Danielle: i agree with you. it might do well not just with the same people
but i don't know if that's a good long term strategy
sorry...always putting on the b-school approach to things
lol
TCM: thats cool though...always teaching me something
i think he'll be cool cause he's still dropping freestyles and guest appearances consistently
go hard
swagger like us
stay up
estelle's joint
he's still rhymin this isn't permanent
lollipop remix
common's new joint
John Legend's album
Danielle: listening to mvp to see what you are referring to
TCM: mvp is illllllll
Danielle: luda is always telling people how great he is
napoleon complex or something
TCM: thats hip hop
braggadacio
bravado
he can take it other places too
but freestyle tracks are my favorite
Danielle: u think still? that hip hop is still about bravado?
i don't know if i still believe that now
TCM: sure it is...
all the biggest emcees stay on that shit
its just not put out there commercially in the same way
labels steer it towards the club
Danielle: i dunno j. mvp is ok.
i don't see him doing anything really different on this track
TCM: what???
the beat is sick
luda is droppin lines on that!!
I'm going back to it right now
Danielle: the beat is cool (for me it holds the song up) but that's about it
it reminds me of a slower version of that Virgo song he did with Nas for some reason
TCM: that song was hot too
Danielle: yup. introduced you to that song
the beat is a little old school, no?
its a cool beat but...
TCM: ''damn man, what the hell you smokin' on / its ludacris, i got more cheese than provolone''
yeah...thats why the beat is dope
thats Premiere
Danielle: i swear he has said a similar line to something like that before
TCM: i love the beat
Danielle: maybe thats what not working for me with the song then
TCM: "takin' shots like Kennedy!!!!"
Danielle: tight old school beat with same luda lines
TCM: whooooaaaaa
Danielle: is the whole cd like this?
TCM: ouch
nah..theres a lot of story telling and perspective rhymes
i don't know what happened to you, D. i thought you'd love this song
i got that one all wrong
Danielle: haha. yeah. i think you thought i would like it a lot for the beat
TCM: the scratches are ridiculous
aight...here's a song you'll like
Lets stay together
Danielle: you know what it is
TCM: what is it
Danielle: i think i "hear" a lot more than i used to in the past
TCM: You'll love Do The Right Thang...infact...listen to that one now
Danielle: i like this one better
TCM: yeah...thats your ish
back on track
Danielle: maybe i'm leaning more towards conscious hip hop in my old age?
TCM: yeah...you are
i am too
its more intellectually stimulating
but i still love ill cypher rhymes
Danielle: yeah. i think in terms of order of listening
i hear what folks are sayin first
then i hear how they are saying it (ie: flow, rhyme etc)
then lastly i listen to beat
i think when i was younger that order was reversed
TCM: yeah...i can tolerate a wack beat if the lyrics are dope
but not as often the other way around
Danielle: precisely - well those are mostly club songs so you can shake ur ass to it regardless of what they say - u know "till the sweat drip down my balls" type stuff. which is maybe why i didn't gravitate to MVP. i heard what he was saying first and it just reminded me of some of his older albums
TCM: HAHAHA!!
that shit was funny
"til the sweat drip down my balls!!"
"now drown a bitch! drown a bitch!!"
Danielle: lol
TCM: yeah...but MVP isn't sweat drip down my balls type shit
Danielle: im not saying it is
what i'm saying is that i heard what he was saying
rather than listening to the beat first
whereas a couple of years ago.
i would have listened to the beat first
TCM: but what he's saying is dope
Danielle: and probably would have liked it more
i'm not saying what he says isn't good. its just typical luda
perhaps i was looking for something more?
i'm not sure what...
TCM: luda's always been like that
freestyle tracks
Danielle: i know. which is why i'm not sure why i was expecting more.
TCM: and concept tracks
and just recently started adding emotional tracks
Danielle: yeah. at first i wasn't sure how i liked luda and emotion but it works ok
if i want to think about heartache and longing though, i'll go to kanye's album
TCM: LOL
thats the truth
full circle
Danielle: yup.

The Quotable Reviews: 808s & Heartbreak

"I'm a monster. / I'm a maven. / I know this whole world's changin'" - "Amazing"

Fresh off the success of his now-near-classic LP, Graduation (and subsequent album-sales-shalacking of 50 Cent), tragedy rocked through Kanye West's self-important world when his mother, Dr. Donda West, died from cosmetic surgery related complications[1]. The loss of his mother, along with ending his engagement (to Alexis Phifer), combined with the obligatory difficulties dealing with pop-star status provided the inspiration for the concepts behind The Louis Vuitton Don's fourth studio album, 808s & Heartbreak.

808s & Heartbreak is unlike any other album in Kanye's catalogue. For starters, he's not rapping, opting to half-sing-half-croon through T-Pain's ubiquitous Vocoder electronic voice manipulator.

Thats right. All beats. No rhymes.

Furthermore, Heartbreak's all 808-drum beat production and all love content mark the first true concept album of 'Ye's career.

Always pushing the envelope.

But the risk behind this concept is whether or not Mr. West's loyal fan base and Hip Hop heads alike will buy-into this form of artistic expression. Emphasis on buy. This isn't a Rap album. This is a Pop album.

THATS RIGHT. ALL BEATS. NO RHYMES.

And Hip Hop is notoriously critical of its most-valued Emcees veering left creatively (Common's Electric Circus nearly ended his career relevance and most cats cringed at the thought Andre-Three-Stacks rockin' without rhyming. Then he dropped "Hey Ya" and all was good. Its funny how winning multiple Grammies can make people forget). Not to mention that Kanye's lack of humility and perceived bitchassness has supplanted a Times-Square-Target-sign sized bullseye on his back. People want him to fail. Can't wait to hate. Prey and pray on his downfall. Does Ye's Pop experiment provide ammo to the enemy? Ride with us as...

THE QUOTABLE REVIEWS: 808s & HEARTBREAK

"And my head keeps spinnin.' / I can't stop having these visions. / I got to get with it." - "Welcome to Heartbreak"

Bass and heartache abound all through 808s & Heartbreak. The album opens with minimalist production and a plodding 808 drum beat on "Say You Will." Yep, Ye's definitely singing. Or something something like it. Honestly, this is the worst track on the album. The beat is dope, moving almost. But I'd fall asleep if it wasn't for the bass line. Plus, the vocals are underwhelming and the lyrics sound like the internal justifications of a date-rapist ("When I grab your neck / I touch your soul").

Following a 3 minute and 14 second instrumental to end the opening track, the album rises with one of the LP's brightest spots, "Welcome to Heartbreak." "My friend showed me pictures of his kids. / And all I could show him was pictures of my cribs. / He said his daughter got a brand new report card. / All I got was a brand new sports car." My oldest friend and his wife just had a baby. A beautiful baby girl. I remember back in '99 when he was sweatin' her at The Racquetclub, and now they're starting a family. Me? I'm still chasing the dream - searching for something real in the world. And theres nothing wrong with that - nothing at all. But it is a reminder that I have yet to truly own, truly create that which is most important in this world - love and family. This cut hits close to home (minus the cribs and sports cars. More like...rent and Metrocards. I keeps 'em clean, though).


"Heartless"

808s hits its stride on tracks 3 through 10. "Heartless" is a head-nod enducing ode to the eventual heartache of an unwanted breakup. 'Ye borrowed Dre's repetitive-keys, layed them over a thumping bass-line, and crooned his ass to a hit record. Possibly one of the hardest heartbreak tracks ever. "Amazing" feels like a marching tribal revolution with Young Jeezy's gruff ad libs adding the exclamation points. Even Da Snowman's verse here is quality (and I'm certainly not a Jeezy fan). This is the first track worth running back after first listen.

"Ok, I'm back up on my grind. / You do you, and I'm just gon' do mine. / You do you, and I'm just gon' be fine. / Ok, I got you out my mind." - "See You in My Nightmares"

Kanye continues with the brooding 808s and tribal-drum break down on "Love Lockdown," while opining on not loving the right way in a relationship. The beat and piano keys feel like that scene in The Matrix: Revolutions when Morpheus gives his I-know-it-looks-like-we're-marching-into-our-fiery-destruction-but-trust-me-it-will-work-out speech followed by all of Zion erupting into a massive, primal, half-butt-naked, tribal, dance party. Or, as my homegirl Noelle calls it, an "audio aphrodisiac".


"Love Lockdown"

808s peaks on the infectious "Paranoid." Sounding like straight out of the '80s pop-music, this club ready track is the closest 'Ye gets to rappin', as he questions why she's "so paranoid" about infidelity ("Yeah you heard about all the word of mouth / don't worry about what we can't control. / All the talk in the world, lost in the world / til you finally let that thang go. / You wanna check into the Heartbreak Hotel, but sorry we're closed").

"Robocop" explemplifies 'Ye's masterful production, showcasing another thumping beat (this albums' designed to bump in the truck...err...Hybrid) with bouncing, triumphant violin strings layered within. "Street Lights" is more of a subdued extended hook than a conventional song. The Louis Vuitton Don repeats the same chorus five or six times with ad lib-like interjections on life's unfairness arising sporadically. Its as if he only had the hook and the melody and decided not to fill in the blanks. Oddly enough, it sounds pretty decent. "Bad News" is an unfortunate, near-ballad about finding out you're getting played. Similarly to "Say You Will," if it wasn't for the bass line, I would have fallen asleep. Lil Wayne assists on the anthemic "See You in My Nightmares," providing his own Auto-Tuned crooning for the hook. The LP closes with rumbling drums and electric keys on "The Coldest Winter," and then "Untitled," a live performance of "Pinocchio's Story" where 'Ye expresses his frustration with pop-stardom and mourns the loss of his mother. A suitable close to an uncompromising album.

"Do you really have the stamina / for everybody that sees you that say 'wheres my camera?' / For everybody that sees you that say 'sign my autograph. / For everybody that sees you, crying, sayin' 'you all of that'" - "Untitled"

Ending after only 12 tracks, 808s & Heartbreak is sleek and to the point. It never wavers from its concept, and stays true to its title: 808 beat-laced production and a contextual focus on heartache. At best its a thumping, melodic, drive-by on matters of the heart. Tracks like "Welcome to Heartbreak," "Amazing," "Heartless," showcase 'Ye's top-shelf songwriting and production skills and overshadow the fact that he's not rapping. Like Graduation, (read review here), the production is anthemic. Its melodic, bass heavy, and crafted to be felt physically and emotionally. In fact, the soundscape reveals as much, if not more, of the emotional revelations Mr. West has experienced over the past year than the lyrics (and the Vocoder actually allows Kanye's voice to meld into the electric bass-line and keys, acting like an instrument in the techno-esque-ensemble). And in that sense the album is effective. The stadium-ready production, infectious melody, and memorable hooks are so rich that they nearly compensate for the fact that Kanye West cannot sing at all!

I mean at all.

Even with an electronic voice enhancer.

But 808s & Heartbreak is crippled by its potential lack of replay-value. "Untitled" is unlistenable. "Say You Will" is saved by the beat. And "Bad News" is one of those tracks that, more often than not, you probably won't be in the mood to hear all the way through. Thats 3 tracks out of 12.

1/4th of the album!!!

Think about it like this. Lets say you're walking down 6th Avenue on a brick-cold day. So cold that you're questioning why the hell you're outside in the first place. But you're bundled up nicely with you're earbuds in and iPod tucked away in your inside coat pocket, bumpin' your favorite track in the world - perfect enough to keep you focused entirely on the music and not on the blistering cold 7 blocks you have left until you reach your subway station.

Then suddenly your favorite track ends. And some wack track comes on right after.

Now you have a choice to make. Do you: A. Undo your perfectly bundled arrangement, letting that BRICK winter air dart your skin, erasing every semblance of warmth collected inside your fabric body armor, instantly reminding you that it is so cold even chicken soup won't help - reach into your pocket, pull out your iPod, and skip to the next track? Or do you: B. Spend the next 4 and a half minutes rushing to the subway while listening to one of the wackest tracks ever, immediately refocusing on the fact that you have no business being outside because its so damn cold???

Unfortunately, on the wrong day, 25% of 808s & Heartbreak will put you in that muttaksuttin' situation. And thats something a great album just doesn't do.

"When did you decide to break the rules? / Cause I just heard some real Bad News." - "Bad News"

Rating: QQQ.5

[1] November 10, 2007. The saddest form of irony considering 'Ye partially made his name by openly discussing self-consciousness on tracks such as the seminal, "All Falls Down"

Carry on...